DEMAND DESTRUCTION MYTH
Before we start today’s tirade against stupidity and wishful thinking, I would like to briefly address the reaction to my article on post-apocalypse banditry. Both an individual in the comments section and Creekmore in an article on his web page pointed out flaws in my reasoning. They did so in a logical and polite manner, unlike certain dill holes that just blather on and get pissy and complain about things I have already clarified ( one example being since I live in a trailer park I can’t teach survivalism even though I preach frugal prepping and frugal living and the cheapest way to live in town is in the trailer park ). I want constructive criticism. If I make an error, let me know. So thank you to the first two. If I write a second part to the subject I’ll try to address those errors. To the irrational emotional critics, I already have a wife.
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Demand destruction is the myth that as soon as oil gets too expensive, demand for it will drop and the supplies we have will last longer and we will never run out of energy and small grey aliens with big slanted eyes will land on the White House lawn and give the First Husband a gratis probe and give the Supreme Dictator For Life Hillary the secret to room temperature fusion and we will all live happily ever after and keep driving our SUV’s around and stay in our thousand square feet per person homes out in the middle of the desert. One problem with this myth is that while a small percentage of the oil in the United States is subject to this purely economic action, by this point oil is a matter of life and death and by the time oil gets too expensive for us to afford we will be starving in the streets.
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Oil to the Third World has always been something of a luxury. It was never so affordable that they gave up water buffalo for tractors. Or, if they did such as in former Soviet satellite states, the process was never so all encompassing or long enough that the old ways couldn’t be re-adopted. The more prosperous states completely surrendered the older ways of food production and transportation and are almost entirely dependant on oil for all life support functions, from crop production to staying alive in severe weather to getting water to drink. After a certain point, those areas that were always poor will be thankful they never became dependant on oil ( unless they are a oil exporting area and then they will all be dead as the oil will be fought over ).
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Once oil becomes truly unaffordable, very few people are going to be able to voluntarily cut back on the amount they use. The Third World already by and large does without any for the most part. Many areas now exporting will need all that they produce for their own population ( such as Russia or Iran ). China can only cut back at the expense of industrial production ( the engine of their economy ). Overly populated regions such as India or Indonesia could only cut back in the farm sector. That would be suicide. As oil supplies dry up, even regions not 100% dependant on oil in the agricultural sector will have less to work with, so even drivers in the cities giving up their mode of transportation will not be enough to run the bare minimum to feed the population. You can’t count on less use when the minimum is used now and as the populations keep growing.
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In the US, sure, we could cut back in certain ways. Giving up wasteful driving. Multiple unneeded trips. Driving as entertainment. Driving short distances we could walk. But that will only take us so far. Car pooling will certainly help. Turning down the thermostat. Allowing redundant businesses to fail. But will this be enough to compensate for a growing population and decreasing supply? We had better hope so, but even if my doubts are unfounded, after a period of time no matter what we do it still won’t be enough. We might wallow in luxury, but such is our dependence, some luxuries are now necessities as there is no alternate way of doing things.
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We used to be swimming in oil. We used to export it, being the global leader. Then FDR got us into a war to enrich his masters at the Federal Reserve and we pretty much pissed through our surplus of both steel and oil. It has been downhill ever since. But we still had enough to become totally dependant on it. When you are surrounded by trees you can’t see the entire forest. Few people gave it any thought. But now, tractors and artificial fertilizers and semi-trucks to the market are no longer nice and easy ways of feeding ourselves but in fact are pretty much the only way. We can’t just hitch back up the mule team or go back to natural fertilizer, or for that matter we can’t expect the tax code to be changed to encourage self-sufficient farmers. The guv’mint wants its pound of flesh and something as simple as food security will not deter them. As in everything in our society every activity has multiple parasites attached to it and they won’t let Peak Oil stand in the way. In a way it is good. Official corruption is institutionalized. Everyone pays the same bribe instead of it being a unknowable expense. But in the long run it is still corruption and impedes survival through adaptation.
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At the same time that we have an increasing population ( if you believe the official figures for illegals you have been smoking crack-at least double that ) we also are seeing oil production decline everywhere. When Mexico runs out of enough oil to increase both problems we will really see the effects. We can’t cut back past a certain point. Our military will most likely be using even more oil in the future as we go to war in other areas to steal even more oil ( the Pentagon is the globes biggest user ). Not that I object. The cold hard facts are that people have always stolen what they needed to survive. I realize it is all for the benefits of our leaders and I am only benefited in a secondary manner ( as in, I’ll survive longer even if at a lower living standard ). But the facts are also that you can’t squeeze blood from a stone. When oil gets scarce but demand only falls slightly and more people populate the place, it will eventually spell the end. In the end the algae take over the pond and no more oxygen is available.
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Even if we could transition back to renewable living through local organic farming and train only transportation, the population is too large for that. Too many mouths to feed, not enough land for low tech growing. Or enough energy and resources to relocate the population to centralized dwellings to reclaim farmland. We simply can’t cut back enough on demand to sustain the population that is growing as our supplies contract.
END
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Friday, August 10, 2007
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23 comments:
i think it's kind of funny the way almost every one of your articles lately has some passive-aggressive criticism about me. at least in the latest one you grew enough of a pair to come right out and address me directly. nice to know my comments continue to live with you and gnaw at you. maybe you'll finally realize something of value, instead of dwelling in your little world of book-learned armchair trailer survivalism.
The way demand destruction will happen here is when all those Mcmansions are foreclosed on, the current tenants evicted, and the utility's are turned off. then as the yuppie kids move back into their parents basements, and can't make payments on those SUV's they will get repo'ed as well. You get higher density housing, and people can only afford to take the bus. Demand destruction is not voluntary, it's forced because you can't afford otherwise
"one example being since I live in a trailer park I can’t teach survivalism"
care to point out where that example is? because it wasn't my point at all. but then, it's pretty clear that reading comprehension isn't your forte, given the statement you recently made about kunstler's conclusions. not even close. try READING what's on the page instead of what you'd like to think is there.
try not to get so defensive. you're not very good at it. i guess if you can't regurgitate someone else's ideas, you really don't know how to respond.
btw, here's some constructive criticism: develop your own writing style instead of pretending you're the richard daughty of survivalism.
"dill hole". that's rich. i take back all my criticisms. i didn't realize that this blog was being published by a 14-year old. in that case, i must say you seem to be exceptionally bright and informed for someone so young.
keep up the good work young lad! you're a credit to your generation!
8:21-8:40. Twenty minutes spent in attacks. Something is still gnawing at someone, indeed.
He's not 14 years old.
He's mentally retarded
nice one jim. i mean jack. next time try "i know you are but what am i?" it's far more clever.
"Can't we all just get along"? For the love of Pete - if you don't get anything out of the information provided by Jim (by the way -you aren't paying for it) - then go somewhere else.
Its free, its informative and I for one, as a single parent, have gotten a great deal out of this. So it ALL doesn't work, who cares - are you critics correct 100% of the time?? Do let us know after you've walked on that water and reached the other side. I do believe the only man who could do that said "Take the log out of your own eye first, before criticizing others". See ya on the other side - I have to walk around.
Go somewhere else???????
It is the Internet It is free.
Jim or you do not own it.
He's asking for comments. And people are leaving them.
What its your problem.??? If everyone agrees then there is no need to have tha Internet.
Some is wrong And someone is right.
Someone is a patriot and someone is a traitor to this nation.
If you have enough pebbles in your brain you can tell WHO.
Don't feed the TROLLS!
Jerry in SoIL
Very good post today, James.
Too bad about the faceless troll(s)....
Demand destruction is a misnomer, as demand is only (temporarily) suppressed. The demand still exists, it simply cannot be satisfied due to insufficient resources (either in terms of supply or finance).
According to several noted economists and as published in the WSJ based on historical data, petroleum demand within the US is largely (roughly 90%) inelastic. There will be little in the way of voluntary reduction simply because it is not possible under the current paradigm. Prices have risen by five fold since 2000, yet demand is actually UP over the same 7 year period. Our way of life is so utterly dependent upon it that petroleum has become as much of a must have commodity as water is.
OK, been awhile, but here I am.
AS I and so many others have said, this is for learning. if you aren't learning then get along Lil doggies.
like any school the teacher says sit down Johnnie, shut up Johnnie, it takes time that the other students could be learning.
You are wrong the Internet is not for arguing, it is for porn, and information. it is the phone book and encyclopedia of the modern world.
if you want to argue try a posting board or other place you can serial post, let us learn and let Jim teach.
I am sure you can find other outlets than posting negatively her or kicking the small animals in your life. both are a waste of time unless you want scared small animals. Tip in Lost Wages
And the elites know this...
either way we are having a die off...either on mother nature's terms or those of the elite.
the rug is currently being pulled out from underneath us...
the dieoff will commence shortly.
whether oil stops because of economic reasons or geologic reasons...a die off will follow.
it can be no other way.
nice post...just this morning was trying to explain this to a co-worker.
jim if this is what you want on your site i guess you can have it .. i for one am tired of reading what the moronic posters have to say .. these wanna be know it alls ,patriots, bullies or festering asholes that frequent your site .. you seem to let them run rampant. Its sad really,
you have some great ideas .. i have learned alot from you but it seems now its just a free for all .I have read your stuff for some time and have even bought some of your stuff .. i shall not again .
This is why the once mighty USA is quickly tumbling to her knees . Greed, arrogance, and infighting.
Yeah yeah i know i cant spell so save your comments, or publish them .. wont matter to me cuz i have choosen to read else where ..
Good Luck Jim .. i have enjoyed reading your work .I wish you great success in the future. As for SOME of your posters..not all of them ,I too extend to you my good wishes.There are some wise people posting ,the rest of them, who cares ?.. cannon fodder as far as i am conscerned.
wayne from canada
howzabout you morons telling those who criticize to leave take some of your own medicine. if i don't like jim's comments i should leave? howzabout if you don't like my criticisms YOU leave? or here's another idea you fucking brainiacs: don't read the critical comments. if you like jim's essays, read them. and if you don't like the comments, DON'T read them.
wouldn't it be goshdarn golly swell if people came by here and only agreed with you dipshits and never criticized? wouldn't it be lovely if "we all just got along"?
here's a little newsflash for those of who can't stand disagreement: this is the internet and apparently this comment section has been available to the public. there isn't a sign-in for only those who agree, and apparently comments are not subject to approval. IF THAT'S TOO GROWN-UP FOR YOU FUCKTARDS, IF THAT'S TOO MUCH RESPONSIBILITY TO DEAL WITH, maybe YOU should go somewhere else. maybe Disney has a section where you all can interact and make nice nice?
it's real simple here in America: you don't like it, YOU go somewhere else. i can stand disagreement and criticism. if you can't, maybe you should pull your panties out of your vaginas and go somewhere else.
or try a google search for some lotion that might help you grow a pair.
you know what REALLY makes me laugh? YOU GUYS THINK YOU'RE GOING TO HANDLE THE STRESSES OF SHTF BUT YOU CAN'T EVEN REFRAIN FROM WHINING WHEN I CRITICIZE JIM. you think you can handle survival in extreme circumstances when you can barely keep from soiling yourselves when someone prints some words don't like on your favorite website? like i said: GROW A PAIR, YOU WHINEY LITTLE DIPSHITS.
i'm NOT leaving. get used to it. or petition jim to not allow unapproved commentary.
buncha' little girls. i can't wait for SHTF so i can come over and EAT YOUR LUNCH.
btw, if you can't take it, don't dish it out. simple really. you wanna' take pot shots at "yuppie survivalists"? i'm the self-appointed spokesman for yuppie survivalists everywhere. if you can't deal with a fight, don't provoke those who'll fight back.
i haven't said ANYTHING since my initial defense of "yuppie survivalists." until TODAY when jim referred to me as a dill hole. so i came to my own defense. don't like it? DON'T FUCKIN' PROVOKE ME. can't take it? DON'T DISH IT OUT.
simple, really.
Wow the parents are not watching the childern's computer sites. I really hate it when the little 16 year old geaks get on. I enjoy reading your site as well as others. If it bothered me as much as it bothers the kids I just would not read you.
I understand the minimalist mind set haveing been there. I did more with less then all the rich know it all did with gobs of cash.
My current survival concept is skill. Building and manufacturing skill. I stock up, build and work toward improving my skills and knowledge daily.
I wish you the best, and as for the brats out there, to heck with them.
Chuck in Phoenix. I want you to know who I am when I post.
Billy from U.S.
This is getting sad. Jim you need to step up and do something about this. This your blog and you are responsible for what goes on here. All you need to do is shut off the comments in your blogger setting. Select hide comments, and presto no more of this crap. If you don't step up to the plate and do something you will loose all your readers.
Another Good Post Mr. Jim.
For all of you Swipers with your Anonymous postings please grow a pair and at least come up with a screen name.
Perhaps Backstabber, or Sniper or perhaps "one who has many motherly sexual fixations" or just plain "Little man with little stuff"
The reason I have so many weapons and ammo in my SHTF preps is because I know the world is full of people just like you obnoxious
kids and, I and mine, will be holding the perimeter security area with your kind in mind when you come to try and take what is mine because you did not study and educate yourself on the ways of the world.
I feel much better now even though it looks like I sunk to their level. My Bad.
Boy that Mr./Ms anonymous sure has a lot to say. I can't take anyone seriously though who refuses to identify themselves. If they truly believe in what they are saying they need to be public about who they are when they are saying it. Not that picking a screen name makes you public lol but at least it gives a name to use. I don't always agree with what Jim posts but at least he is posting his thoughts and using his name and standing up for what he believes in.
I plan to buy a fifth wheel camper on craiglist this winter, I have been noticing a few beeing sold on the cheap last winter.
I bought an old barn on ten acres in northern minnesota and plan to install this camper in the upper level of the barn, surrounding it with straw bales for insulation. The barn should act as a good buffer for minnesotas harsh winters and a good hideout. I plan to put a couple of gaurd dogs in the lower area of the barn where the cows use to be. Theres even enough room up above the barn to put patio furniture out.
Sorry wrong thread, that comment belongs in the two liter masonry post.
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